Is there a lesson that explains this use of l/le? I see it a lot, but I don't fully understand when it is needed and when it isn't needed.
Just like in English with although and even if, you can express concession in French with two different expressions : bien que and même si.
BUT these two expressions won't be followed by the same tense mood.
Bien que + Le Subjonctif
Je suis en retard bien que je sois parti à l'heure.
I'm late even though I left on time.
Elle ne le fait pas, bien qu'elle le puisse.
She isn't doing it, although she can.
Bien que l'on ne s'entende pas, c'est quand même mon frère!
Although we don't get along, he's still my brother!
Bien qu'il ne soit pas fatigué, il devrait aller se coucher.
Even though he is not tired, he should go to bed.
ATTENTION:
Do not confuse bien que (although) with expressions using bien followed by que (that):
J'aimerais bien que tu fasses le petit-déjeuner.
I would like you to make breakfast.
-> Here it's the expression aimer bien (to like) followed by que.
Même si + L'Indicatif
Même s'il n'est pas fatigué, il devrait aller se coucher.
Even if he is not tired, he should go to bed.
Même si l'on ne s'entend pas, c'est quand même mon frère!
Even if we don't get along, he's still my brother!
Même si je le voulais, elle ne me laisserait pas y aller.
Even if I wanted it, she wouldn't let me go.
Même si elle lui parlait, il ne changerait pas d'avis.
Even if she spoke to him, he wouldn't change his mind.
The difference between bien que + Le Subjonctif and même si + L'Indicatif is similar to the difference between although and even if, the first being more elegant and subtle than the latter.
Learn more about these related French grammar topics
Examples and resources
Même si elle lui parlait, il ne changerait pas d'avis.
Even if she spoke to him, he wouldn't change his mind.
Je suis en retard bien que je sois parti à l'heure.
I'm late even though I left on time.
Même si je le voulais, elle ne me laisserait pas y aller.
Even if I wanted it, she wouldn't let me go.
Bien que l'on ne s'entende pas, c'est quand même mon frère!
Although we don't get along, he's still my brother!
Elle ne le fait pas, bien qu'elle le puisse.
She isn't doing it, although she can.
Même s'il n'est pas fatigué, il devrait aller se coucher.
Even if he is not tired, he should go to bed.
Même si l'on ne s'entend pas, c'est quand même mon frère!
Even if we don't get along, he's still my brother!
Bien qu'il ne soit pas fatigué, il devrait aller se coucher.
Even though he is not tired, he should go to bed.
Q&A Forum 15 questions, 27 answers
Hi Michelle,
L'on is an optional form of on and is used mainly in the literary domain after words ending in a vowel, notably single sylable words such as: qui, que, ou, où, si, et, to aid euphony . It is never used after the word dont nor is it used before a word starting with 'l' to avoid the alliterative sound of two 'l's'
si on loge chez moi... rather than si l'on loge chez moi...
où on l'avait vu rather than où l'on l'avait vu
In speech l'on is often used to avoid the sound of the vulgar homonym con in such phrases as:
Les toiles qu'on peut admirer au musée which may be rendered as Les toiles que l'on peut admirer au musée
Hope this helps,
Tom
In this case the "le" is purely phonetic. It is not a personal pronoun.
Michelle I was just reviewing this lesson and saw the same l'on construction and had the same question but had decided not to pursue it and clutter up the thread! Many thanks for asking, on everyone's behalf. I have never before noticed this particular literary/phonetic construction. Now I shall see it everywhere, I expect!

"Bien que l'on ne s'entende pas"
Is there a lesson that explains this use of l/le? I see it a lot, but I don't fully understand when it is needed and when it isn't needed.
Don't have an account yet? Join today
bien que...grammar within this example
« bien qu’on ne s’entend pas, c’est quand même mon frère ». this is not the right place to ask this question but the example is here!
what is the rule that says « c’est quand même » instead of « il est quand même » mon frère?

Hi Marnie,
You cannot say in French for, it is/this is :
Il est mon frère, elle est ma sœur, elle est ma fille , il est mon oncle , elle est Marie, il/elle est mon ami/e, il est mon prof. etc...
you can only say:
c'est mon frère, c'est ma sœur , c'est ma fille, c'est mon oncle, c'est Marie, c'est mon copain/ma copine, c'est mon prof, etc.
Look at the following lesson :
There is still a lot of confusion about this and we are on it but in the meantime if you look at the Q&A section at the bottom of this lesson and in particular at our answers you might get a flavour of what is correct and not.
Hope this helps!
bien que...grammar within this example
« bien qu’on ne s’entend pas, c’est quand même mon frère ». this is not the right place to ask this question but the example is here!
what is the rule that says « c’est quand même » instead of « il est quand même » mon frère?
Don't have an account yet? Join today
Could you give an example of the “bien que” followed by and indicatif, as you mention in the warning?
Je sais bien que tu viens me voir demain.
Here the bien is an adver to savoir and is distinct from the bien que meaning "although" and demanding the subjunctive.
Could you give an example of the “bien que” followed by and indicatif, as you mention in the warning?
Don't have an account yet? Join today
Imparfait after subjunctive? Just use imparfait subjunctive?
I just took one of the writing quizzes and am confused by two grammar issues: using imparfait after "bien que". The sentence: "even though she had already been camping in this forest for a week.
1. I wrote: "Bien qu'elle campait déjà depuis une semaine dans cette forêt" I assumed this is correct because we're saying "had already been" with depuis. However, the correct answer was supposed to be, "Bien qu'elle campe déjà dans cette forêt depuis une semaine" ( I thought the present tense with "depuis" would mean "was or has been"camping).
2. Also, since the verb is after "bien que" should we use the subjunctive imparfait: compât ? "Bien qu'elle campât déjà depuis une semaine dans cette forêt"

From what I understand, the imperfect subjunctive is archaic and that is the reason it would be considered preferable to use the present subjunctive.
Imparfait after subjunctive? Just use imparfait subjunctive?
I just took one of the writing quizzes and am confused by two grammar issues: using imparfait after "bien que". The sentence: "even though she had already been camping in this forest for a week.
1. I wrote: "Bien qu'elle campait déjà depuis une semaine dans cette forêt" I assumed this is correct because we're saying "had already been" with depuis. However, the correct answer was supposed to be, "Bien qu'elle campe déjà dans cette forêt depuis une semaine" ( I thought the present tense with "depuis" would mean "was or has been"camping).
2. Also, since the verb is after "bien que" should we use the subjunctive imparfait: compât ? "Bien qu'elle campât déjà depuis une semaine dans cette forêt"
Don't have an account yet? Join today
Même si
Cannot "même si" be equally followed l'imparfait del'ndicatif as in:
Même s'il me le disait, je ne le croirais pas.

Hi Tom,
Yes of course you can use the imparfait after 'même si', as in your example and the following one,
"Même si je voulais le faire, je ne le ferais pas."
The point of the lesson is that it is a tense from the Indicative Mood and not the Subjunctive in the case of 'bien que'.
Hope this helps!
Cécile, thanks for your helpful reply.
It's just that the lesson specifically states :
"Même si can also mean even if / even though, however it's always followed by Le Présent Indicatif and never Le Subjonctif."
which would seem to mandate only the use of Le Présent de l'Indicatif to the exlusion of other tenses of l'Indicatif.
Thanks again.

Bonjour Tom !
Thanks very much for your feedback!
Indeed, the lesson needed to be updated as "même si" can be followed by any tense in L'Indicatif :)
It's now done!
Merci et bonne journée !
Même si
Cannot "même si" be equally followed l'imparfait del'ndicatif as in:
Même s'il me le disait, je ne le croirais pas.
Don't have an account yet? Join today
Puis-je utiliser le mot "quoique" dans cette phrase?

Yes, here quoique is a synonym of bien que, and will also be followed by Le Subjonctif.
Elle ne le fait pas, bien qu'elle le puisse.
Elle ne le fait pas, quoiqu'elle le puisse.
À bientôt !
Puis-je utiliser le mot "quoique" dans cette phrase?
Don't have an account yet? Join today

Don't have an account yet? Join today

Don't have an account yet? Join today
Ne explétif

Don't have an account yet? Join today
Le chien aboie bien qu' il n'y ________ personne."

Le chien aboie bien qu' il n'y ________ personne."
Don't have an account yet? Join today

Identifying bien que not bien as an adjective



Identifying bien que not bien as an adjective
Don't have an account yet? Join today
"Meme s'il n'est pas fatigué, il devrait aller se coucher" Is it less correct to

"Meme s'il n'est pas fatigué, il devrait aller se coucher" Is it less correct to
Don't have an account yet? Join today

Don't have an account yet? Join today
Isn't the verb after même si in the example le conditionel présent?

Bonjour Michèle,
The verb after même si is est, the present tense of être. The verb later in the sentence is conditional, yes, but that's not connected to même si.
Don't have an account yet? Join today

We have a lesson on "ainsi que" that you can see here:
https://www.french-test.com/revision/grammar/ainsi-que-as-well-as-as
Please let us know if you have further questions! A bientôt !
Don't have an account yet? Join today